Club Eternia 2013, Cont’d

Scott Neitlich posted the following on the Mattycollector forums last night in response to a question as to where the MOTUC subs stand right now:

We have over 50% to go. We are at 46% of the min orders we need as of right now.

If we don’t hit 100% of the min it means fewer figs at higher prices (i.e. 30-35.00 per figure and likely only 4-6 figs for the whole year)

Forty-six percent of the required minimum tells me that all the discussion of the Star Sisters, QC, and CS issues is fairly inconsequential. The QC and CS issues have been around for almost the entire life of the line, yet they easily hit the required number last year. I have a difficult time believing that Star Sisters are holding anyone back, because the truth is, they were part of last year’s sub, not this year’s – if they were going to hold anyone off subbing, it would have been last year. (It could be argued the incentive figure, King He-Man, is no Shadow Weaver, but I think Ram Man makes up that difference.)

The SS/QC/CS stuff may have eaten away at the margins, but I think the main reason for the lower sub numbers was the price and international shipping increases, plain and simple. If it had been just the price increase of just the shipping increase, the damage might have been more mitigated. But with both hitting at once, MOTUC may have been dealt a mortal blow.

There’s not going to be another rush of subscribers – those happen in the first few days. I don’t like being a downer, but I just don’t see how they double the sub numbers by August 6 – unless there are some e-tailers who hop on board and save the line.

There’s been some talk that many people have been holding off to get paid at the end of this month or the first of August. I’m skeptical that 50% of the needed subscribers are in that boat, but I guess we’ll see.

UPDATE: On second thought, the total cost of the 2013 sub (before shipping) is $505, while the total cost of the 2012 sub was $510. It’s pretty much identical to last year, it’s just more per figure. So now I’m not sure how much the price increase figures into it, although I’m sure there’s a certain psychological resistance to paying an extra $5 per figure that factors in to collectors’ thinking (including mine, but I went ahead anyway).

Comments now closed (109)

  • What you need is a thermometer. Us DC fans have one, it enables you to become depressed and despondent, but at least a little richer each month, almost instantly!

    • I agree that this year has just had WAY too much going on. However, if 2013 goes through it would only be the 12 monthly figures plus the four bonus items.

  • It might get less. I'm trying to cancel the duplicated subs the system placed for me and charged my credit card for…

  • Its EVERYTHING. Price increases, QC issues, character selection, and a crappy attitude from Mattel when they try to strong arm everyone. It’s just not the way to do business.

  • I would be fine with just a figure a month. Always have been. Ever since last year's SDCC announcements, I've had a bad feeling that this line was just growing too fast. I appreciate the effort to go all out for the 30th anniversary, but I think there were just too many new or obscure characters introduced that people were just not interested in having as part of an all-in subscription.

  • I was thinking yesterday that they need to but the thermometer up on the site. So people can actually SEE where they are in terms of the minimum. People are going to put it off and out it off saying "Oh they'll meet the minimum without me". They need motivation. The Doomsayers out there have the floor and aren't helping the case either.

    If Int'l shipping is the main factor (and it probably is) Mattel needs to address this ASAP. they may have underestimated how many Int'l customers they have. I doubt DR can pull that info for them easily. They need a Plan B and promote the heck out of it. Hell, offer the Int'l customers an exclusive Variant figure or something.

    • Yes, because the thermometer is clearly working so well to motivate fans to buy the DCIE sub, isn't it?

  • The price increases, weak characters, poor customer service, terrible QC, and the way Toy Guru treats collectors like they’re idiots are all factors as to why they can’t sell subs. It’s not just one single reason. I’m not buying because I don’t give a crap about Netossa and Granymyr. Another person is going to pass because of the cost of international shipping. They’ve given us too many reasons not to trust them after their their empty promises to make improvements. And now they’re like, “Why won’t you give us five hundred dollars?”

  • The price per figure and the Fighting Foe Men are the things stopping me. Paying $33.70 per figure has always bothered me, and regardless of Matty’s feelings that is what we are paying. Increasing that to almost forty dollars per was just too much. But I love this line and if there hadn’t been such a huge chunk of “do not want” – the FFM – I know darn well I would have convinced myself to do it. Not crazy about Netossa or Snake Face either. Snake Face isn’t neccesarily bad, it’s just that he represents a vast potential for characters that I do not give a rat’s tuckus about. Here’s how I think Matty could have overcome the pricing issues: announce the whole year. And make it good. I could go on and on about that concept, but I just realized I should save that for my own blog! ;)

  • I wonder if they would have met the required number if they had made Ram Man the subscription figure.

    • Given the warnings we've received about how there will be little or no day-of-sale stock, I tend to doubt it. I think making him the sub figure would have done little except make people even angrier.

      What they should have done is come up with a better incentive than King He-Man – a version of the character that doesn't even exist outside the bios. Pretty much anything might have been better – NA He-Man, perhaps, or Snake Armor He-Man, a version many fans weren't able to get in the Millennium line.

      • King He-Man appears in The Powers Of Grayskull Part 2 minicomic, and was designed by Wellinton Alves. This is similar to when they made a figure of Bruce Timm’s Preternia Disguise He-Man variant. The idea of a King He-Man was introduced in Lou Scheimer’s “Dare: Son Of He-Man” pitch, so it’s not really a new concept.

        I do agree that one of the vintage variants would have been a better choice for the sub slot.

  • I disagree that there will be no more influx of subscribers and that most do it on the first day. I guarantee you there will be a deluge of subscribers at the very end of the window, myself included.

    I'm getting a sub. I'm not happy about it. I would rather pick and choose what I want. Mattel and Digital River continue to manage this line poorly. At least, if they feel this is in jeopardy for a short period, they may get the message and make some significant changes both this year and next.

    Thats why I am waiting until the last moment. Because I'm a jerk.

    • I too am waiting until the last minute (at first it was because I was trying to make up my mind on the DC sub– now that it's clearly dead in the water, it's because I am lazy).

    • I am also waiting to the last minute. I seem to do this every year….why, not 100% sure. I think it has to do with my lack of trust in Mattel….this way I can see all the stuff they have to say till the 6th, and decide if anything changes that makes me not want to get the sub.

      So I agree, I don’t think there will be a surge of people the same size as the initial days surge, but it still might be pretty large.

      And even though they say there will be no more extensions this year….I have my doubts. When it comes down to money, and they see they still need more of it to justify this year, I can see them extending it. They will throw out the threat….”because we didn’t meet the goal, we cannont do MOTUC this year…but because we want to do everything in our power to make this happen for the fans, we are going to extend the subscription period one time, even though we said we were not going to do it.”

      • I wouldn't be surprised to see them do that.

        Personally, I think it's rather foolish on their part to have such a small window of time (around 24 days) for the subs to be available to purchase.

        • I'm hoping they'll actually address some of the issues properly and if I felt there was actually going to be support for international subscribers, I'd sign up like a shot. I'd still like to subscribe as I'd love Ram Man, and I actually like the Foe men – especially the creepy blue guy.

  • They're still not big on showing off the merchandise on the subscription pages, are they?

  • I don't think you can say that the price increase is sort of a wash because this year's sub is only $5 more than last year's sub, because you're getting LESS this year than last. So you're paying more, for less product.

    Honestly, I don't think you should underestimate the power of the Star Sisters. I blame a lot of this on them. Not necessarily that pack, but that mentality. You can't get rid of the Star Sisters, short of selling them at a heavily reduced price. Once you're sticking fans with that kind of crap (much less the fact that these are figures most fans didn't want and at worst, can't even put into the MOTUC displays because they're such gaudy "girly" figures) then people get tired of taking the pocketbook abuse.

    I think the subs are low because a big chunk of international people dropped the sub and the rest of us said "enough is enough, I'm done" because of stuff like the Star Sisters. With a dash of an incredibly weak 2013 lineup, short of Ram Man.

    • See, people calling the 2013 reveals “weak” baffles me.

      That we KNOW of there’s:

      The most loudly requested character in the line.

      TWO of the remaining four names Snake-Men

      A fairly popular Evil Warrior

      A Filmation character that, while I don’t know if he was heavily requested is both an Evil Warrior and has extensive new tooling and a neat design.

      And the Fighting Foe-Men (who while maybe not amazing certainly don’t suck)

      Where’s the weak line-up again?

      • The reason you keep hearing people say the lineup for 2013 is weak, is because it is. I said Ram Man was good, so who are the other weak guys? All of them. And at this point Ram Man seemed like a given. Ram Man should have been made a year or so ago before Tytus or Gygor, etc. A lot of folks feel like Ram Man isn't enough. Yes we want him, but it's like dragging a tease out for too long. Now he's expected more than anticipated.

        Pretty simple.

        Nobody even knows who the FFM are. They appeared in some random thing that only a handful of people even have. That's $75 of the $500 right there on guys virtually nobody had ever even heard of.

        Jitsu has fans, so we'll call him popular enough.

        Fang man is okay, but like you said he wasn't heavily requested.

        We know Snake Face, but he's arguably the worst of the Snake Men. Who's the other? Rattlor is this year. Did they announce Tung Lashor or Sssqueeze and I miss it?

        So even if you LOVE Ram Man, Jitsu and Fang man, you're still batting about 50/50 with the FFM. Toss in Netossa (and let's face it POP stuff is divisive at best) and King He-Man (another new made up character who happens to have a pretty lame design) and you've got FIVE figures that aren't popular versus three that are "good" with only one MUST HAVE for most people.

        Mattel dropped the ball on the reveals.

        • Netossa I can’t really comment on because I didn’t / don’t follow POP. I don’t know if she was a particularly desired character but I’ve enjoyed the POP figures I’ve gotten or seen so far (yes even the Star Sisters to a degree).

          Let’s face it, of the subsclusive figures only Shadow Weaver was especially interesting and she only had that slot by circumstance. Those figures SHOULD be more a bonus than a must have anyway.

          The Foe-Men are… The Foe-Men. I’m just not a fan of the idea of three packs in general. I’ll concede they are probably a turn off to a lot of people.

          The rest I don’t agree on at all. What makes Jitsu or the Snake-Men okay but not great? If it had been Rio-Blast, Squeeze and Clamp Champ, plenty of people would be, “But we need Jitsu, Rattlor, and Snake-Face too!”

          And I’m sorry but your argument that Snake-Face is somehow inferior to the other Snake-Men characters is just silly. They’re all equally bizarre and wonderful.

        • I'll give you that the Sub exclusives shouldn't be great, but I loved Wun-Dar and I liked Shadow Weaver. I find that the sub exclusive is an important factor in determining if I subscribe or not. The one year I didn't subscribe was the year they tried to pawn off He-Man in a dress as an exclusive. That was a BIG part of why I didn't subscribe.

          Netossa is pretty popular among POP people I think, but I think the POP loyalists is a pretty tiny fraction of the overall pie to be honest.

          I'm probably biased, but I never cared for Jitsu. He was a later addition to the line and he looks like Super Friends Samurai, but with a giant hand. Meh. But I'll concede that he's a moderately popular character.

          Rattlor is in THIS year's sub, not next year's. I want Rattlor. But he's not part of 2013.

          Snake Face to me at least, was always the worst of the Snake Men. He has a very goofy design and he looked like he belonged in the Real Ghostbusters line. As opposed to the other guys who all more or less looked like snakes. Sssqueeze's gigantic arms notwithstanding.

          I guess we just have to agree to disagree, but there has to be something to the weak lineup argument. I know had Mattel loaded the sub up with some better choices, I would have signed up. As is, I'm skipping. I think if Mattel is only going to show a few figures for the next year's sub and they want people to buy it, they need to show a couple more heavy hitters. And while Ram Man is the biggest heavy arguably left in the line, like I said, most fans sort of view him as someone we should be getting as if it was never in doubt. You need to hit it out the park if you're wanting people to subscribe blindly, ESPECIALLY when a lot of people were sort of disgruntled over the direction the line has been going in for a while and having to overcome a price increase.

          Showing the FFM at all was a HUGE mistake to me. I think a lot of people would have signed up hoping and dreaming that the 3 pack would be some cool Horde troopers or something. Then at least the FFM wouldn't have deterred people. As is, they're being used as a rally cry for a lot of folks on why you SHOULDN'T subscribe. That's just not good.

        • Ha, you’re right on Rattlor (sweet for me as it means he’s sooner.)

          I agree with you absolutely that showing the Foe-Men was totally boneheaded.

          I think a rather large problem that nobody really takes into consideration is that a SIGNIFICANT portion of the big name guys who are left each require a sizeable amount of new tooling.

          Extendar is probably 100% new sculpt
          Two-Bad is at least a new upper body if not 100% new
          Rio-Blast is if they do him even half right is lose to all new.
          Modulak is 100% and a logistical nightmare.
          Mantenna is at least a whole new lower body but probably almost all new.

          When’s the last time we got a figure with 80% or more new tooling? Leech. Before him I think

        • Ha, you’re right on Rattlor (sweet for me as it means he’s sooner.)

          I agree with you absolutely that showing the Foe-Men was totally boneheaded.

          I think a rather large problem that nobody really takes into consideration is that a SIGNIFICANT portion of the big name guys who are left each require a sizeable amount of new tooling.

          Extendar is probably 100% new sculpt
          Two-Bad is at least a new upper body if not 100% new
          Rio-Blast is if they do him even half right is lose to all new.
          Modulak is 100% and a logistical nightmare.
          Mantenna is at least a whole new lower body but probably almost all new.

          When’s the last time we got a figure with 80% or more new tooling? Leech. Before him I think It was Whiplash (and HIS parts had reuse potential, unlike many of the guys we’re missing).

          I can’t imagine how it would be cost effective to start cramming all those significantly newly tooled characters in all at once.

        • Oh I agree, which is why I highly doubt 2014 will be the year that "has everyone that's missing" because so many of the guys that are missing require a lot of tooling.

          Hell, even Gwildor (who I do want quick badly, thank you very much) will require a fair amount of tooling.

        • I don't think Extendar would need t100% new tooling. You just need to make his legs and arms into swappable peg parts and include interchangeable extenders, a la Tallstar. Otherwise he's just got new chest armor, and the rest you can cobble together from other figures.

          Two-Bad would probably need a new upper body – possible.

          Mantenna would probably need too much work – unlikely.

          For Rio-Blast, I think the Horsemen could get creative; rather than having guns that actually flipped out, you'd just have two sets of armor parts, one closed, one open with the guns sticking out, and then maybe just put tampo stickers of cybernetic parts where the holes would have been (a la Faker's chest). Then all you'd really need are the armor parts and a new head.

        • They snuck his shield into the SDCC display case on Friday. Scott acknowledged it in one of his videos and that he was coming.

          You should be able to find pics of it online.

  • I don't understand the price at all? How are these figures high end? I love the four horsemen, I cherry pick the classics line, but I don't place these figures in the same category as a high end collectible. They're just above DCUC. For example: Scarabus was definitely worth the price; it was a short run figure with a lot of work put into it. Every other He man toy has it's ass on backwards, and every other week it seems Mattel issues a statement to the effect, "We had to sell our children to our factory to keep this line going, pay our exorbitant prices and like it."

    • Think of the shirts, my god, won't anyone think of the shirts?! What will Mattel do without their shirts? Hire less MOTU booth babes?

      Remember for just 16 cents a day you can save a starving kid in Africa, err… fund a He-Man toy line!

      • 16 cents is directly, "for the product", the other 75.84 is to cover, "uh, costs, and uh, plastic is so expensive! Shipping! Wonky eye paint! Look, She Ra toys!"

    • "Scarabus was definitely worth the price; it was a short run figure with a lot of work put into it. "

      And yet, the Horsemen still have plenty of Scarabi in stock. Don't think they make their bread-and-butter there – I'd be surprised if they did much better than breaking even. Without some sort of media to support it, or at least pop cultural cachet (i.e., NECA's Predator/Terminator/Robocop stuff), it's just really, really hard to sell action figures these days.

      Compared to what's being charged for action figures these days, I think Scarabus is borderline underpriced. If it were mass-produced for, say, TRU like NECA's stuff, I'd still expect a price point around $20-$25.

      • It's unfortunate that Scarabus hasn't sold out, but my point was was that it was an example of a high end collector figure, and worth the price.
        To your point that it was underpriced, I probably would have paid more, so I agree. But that's what sucks, He Man toys don't pack enough bang for your buck. The few I have were purchased with money tears.

    • I agree that MOTUC isn't much more 'high end' than DCUC. The only thing that remotely puts them into the 'high end' category is the fact they are semi-limited. And I use that term pretty loose. Like you said, Scarabus is limited, and it is also high end because of the work put into it. So why does a re-used buck of He-Man that is used over and over and over again cost about the same as Scarabus? I think it really does come down to the fact that 1) Mattel wants to make money…..but more, 2) The overhead that Mattel pays to do these lines. Where the 4H do it out of love, Mattel has to pay a large number of people to 'run' this line. They have to pay Scott, as well as I am sure a large number of other people to manage it. Sure, it may not be their full time job to deal with MOTUC, but I am sure a lot of time is put into it. If you start adding up all of those salaries, and take that right out of the profit of the toys, I think you will quickly see why we are paying $25 for a $15 toy. It is a bummer, but it is reality.

      I

  • well for me (i live in france ) the global price is almost the same as last year , but what makes a huge difference in the price is the fact that the euro is going down big time . so there is thrree problems :
    - the price hike per figure
    - the price hike for international shipping (+ more riskc to get customs taxes) (+ the fact that ther will be no refund if the package is lost )
    _ and the euro going down big time

    the figures are now much much more expensive . and it 's as simple as that . i can't afford a sub anymore.

    • The same in México ,El peso vs the US dollar (One Dollar cost 13.83 mexicans pesos).

  • Dang son. I thought the $505 included shipping. I think this is just alot of Matty scare tactics to bully stoopid fanboys. I see toys sit for months on Hasbro's online store with no boo-hoo-hoo about you "cherrypickers" yet Matty has fanboys locked into sight-unseen subscriptions and sells out the leftovers within minutes yet now the word is the line is going down the crapper. If you believe that then I have some swamp land in Florida to sell you!

    • The difference between Hasbro Toy Shop and Mattycollector is that Hasbro does NOT have product made specifically for them to sell. HTS buys whatever Hasbro produces and if it sits then its no different than what sits on shelves at Target or Wal-Mart. Mattycollector is the only way to get MOTUC figures. There is no other outlet for them. So let's kill that comparison right now.

  • I think the inclusion of King He-Man alone is enough to make the lineup weak. And they’ll probably throw in his son Dare too.

    Yeah I was wrong about Granymyr being in next years sub. That just shows how little I care about owning a dragon that looks like someone’s grandmother.

  • This will be my first time subbing, but I'm waiting till later, too. My reason is more strategic though. I'm waiting for the thermometer to go up. Once it does, we'll see where we're at and I think a lot of people will sign up at that point and I want to add to the momentum. I'm not crazy about having to sub, but I feel really good about the 2013 reveals. They plus the sub were kind of a watershed moment for me. Knowing that I was going to have figures I might not want (FFM) I had to decide whether that was OK or not. And you know what? It was. And it felt kinda liberating because it broke me out of my vintage-only mindset (still no use for 200X stuff, although Dekker could change that) and now I'm even tempted to go back and get some of the Preternia stuff I skipped. So, yay!

    The promise of 2014 and what it will do to complete collections is also plenty of motivation to buy in.

    • BBTS doesn't buy more than 150-200 subs. You can figure it out how many they have in stock at any given time by putting something, e.g., the Star Sisters, into your cart, then change the quantity to something like 200. The system will then reduce the number to the one they can actually fill. Right now the Star Sisters come out to 129. Assuming BBTS only sold a handful of those, or even being general and saying they sold a decent number, that still can't be more than 200.

      The figure runs have to be at least 5,000 per figure, though I think it might be closer to 8K-10K or more. So 200 figures is just a drop in the bucket (a large drop, but a drop nonetheless). So unfortunately, I have my doubts that the resellers will save the line in this case. But I'll admit I don't know enough to say that for certain.

  • I'm probably gonna get flamed for this but I honestly don't get the "Bullying" comments. How exactly is Mattel "Bullying" us? They laid out the facts (I'm not going to argue any of their points so don't bother) and now the CHOICE is ours.

    Subscribe or not.

    No one is holding a gun to any of our heads. If you want to subscribe it's your choice. If you don't subscribe it's, again, your choice. Is it too expensive for Int'l fans? Sure. Is the shipping in the US expensive for us domestic Fans? Not as much as Int'l but yes.

    But again, OUR choice. no ones forcing anyone. So lets please stop throwing around the term "bullying" so casually. Bully's don't give you a choice.

      • That argument doesn't hold water. How is that different from any other toyline? If they don't sell they don't get made. Look at any other toy line out there, If no one buys it or they don't sell in significant numbers, the company kills the line.

        • It's like this, Hasbro doesn't threaten or continuously jack-up prices; They just take the line out back and shoot it. Pursuit of Cobra, Retaliation, Star Wars Vintage.
          Bandai did it with Thundercats.
          Toy lines that do not turn a profit get killed- I thought that went without saying. What's unusual is a toy line that features poor QC, poor customer service, not a whole lot of bang for your buck, and the strangest fan to company dialogue I've ever seen.

        • Again, No one is forcing anyone to Buy a subscription. You either do or you don't. So where is the bullying? Where are the threats? If the line is financially in danger of getting shut down (And I and no one I know or have read has no proof that it isn't) all Toy Guru is doing is being honest with us. Giving us a heads up. The CHOICE is still ours.

          Also how are they continuously Jacking up prices? As a Sub this is the only Price increase I've seen since I started buying the line when it started. For the Cherry pickers it went up what? $3 last year? And now another $2? We all knew that a price increase was coming. It was mentioned last year. It's not a surprise.

          If the QC issues and Poor CS (And I admit the CS out of DR sucks. I have had dozens of issues with them and have been vocal about them on Matty's boards–under a different name) bother you (You in the general sense, not you personally), then don't buy. it's simple.
          No One is forcing or "bullying" anyone. Lets not mistake Honesty (lend me a grain of salt?) with threats.

        • I'm not sure that anyone truly feels forced or bullied, it's more of internet hyperbole for a situation where consumers are being pressured in an unfair way. I'm a casual collector of this line, if I see something I like I'll do my cost benefit analysis and decide if the price is right. However, this situation is something I'm opinionated enough to comment on. It's a really weird ass situation, unlike anything in the toy community.
          More than anything, I think Mattel's ethics and tactics are a bit dubious.

        • As the cog in the corporate wheel I can tell you that dubious Ethics and Tactics is pretty much a given whenever you are dealing with anything that will turn a profit. But there's always things no one in the outside world (Read: us) that dictate the actions a company takes. I can list a dozen reasons why Mattel is doing things this way. And I'm not apologizing for them. I just know from my experience that Brand managers and Marketers and sales people sometimes have their hands tied sometimes by simple economics and most of the times your boss's boss who only looks at $ signs in order to make a decision.

        • I appreciate your insight.
          Although I'm not in the know enough to comment on the ins and outs of the industry and Mattel, I do feel that the way they have it set up is doomed.
          If they didn't mandate a subscription and simply offered figures on a month to month basis it stands to reason that there would be:
          -Improved QC
          -Improved customer service
          -Better character selection

        • It could be read that they're threatening to take away day-of-sale stock in order to twist collectors' arms into buying a sub if they want anything. Which seems to go against even Matty's own interests since they quickly sell out of day-of-sale stock, showing the demand is there.

    • I've been collecting this line since the very first release of He-Man, and have never subbed. I couldn't care less for straight vintage updates, filmation updates, POP characters or NA characters so I've never subbed. However, I've always managed to get all the figures I've wanted which is a good amount still. However, now it looks like it's either sub or no more figures. There are probably others like me who have never subbed before so to them it looks like bullying.

  • If the sub gets shorted to 4-6 figures, then I might sub just to get a Ram Man and sell the rest. Scalping the others even, or losing a few bucks, might still come in cheaper than the $75-$100 that Rammy will go for. Hell, I might get 2 subs to sell a Ram Man and make a profit off the whole shebang.

    How many other collectors out there are also waiting to see what Scott will do before buying in?

  • MBB… i don't think that's how it's works bra. if you get 4 to 6 figures, it'll be because the sub failed, and those 4 to 6 will be day-of scramble, w/ price increases, so you'd be looking at probably a 40 dollar ram man, but that's all you'd have to spend.

    if the sub flies after all, and you opt in, you're dumping 505 before shipping for the sub, and you're stating your OK taking a bath on the other figs you don't want just to avoid spending 100 on ram man… which means ram man will cost you, in essence, 475 bucks… why is that better than him costing you 100? right now, barring king grayskull and wun-dar, you'd be lucky to get 20 bucks a head for the characters you don't want… so even if you redeemed that 220, ram man will have still cost you 255 bucks, before shipping. i don't see how the math works the way you're calculating it homes.

  • My math is just fine, Lord Condescendor, if the sub failed DOWN to 4-6 figures, which was what I was assuming. I haven't read each and every post all over the web on this controversy, but it would surprise the heck out of me if Matty dumped the sub altogether, throwing aside the few guaranteed sales they had, to go with day-of sales only. That makes as much sense as anything Matty has to date done.

  • there is a reply to a post on the Mattycollector forum that states that Scott recently stated that it is unlikely that Ram Man will get greenlit unless there is a full 2013 sub as the tooling would be too expensive.

      • Holy crap, really? If that's not the best example of the craziness some of us are talking about, then I don't know what is. So the figure that people care the most about might not see the light of day unless everyone submits to a sub?
        Duuuuuuuuuuude….

        • Of course Ram Man won't get greenlit. They'll say ANYTHING to get you to sub at this point.

          I don't believe it. Unfortunately like I said in my thoughts on this earlier this week, if Ram Man ends up a no go, so be it.

          But I'm sure Ram Man will be made, they'll just up the price. As long a it's not upped to $510, I'm in for one.

    • Sadly, that sounds reasonable. He's what, all new parts? if the line is tanking, they are going to want to cut costs.

  • … and Frosta has been dropped back to October with a glib comment on Mattycollector.

        • Apologies if I misread it – Mattycollector news posts:

          "Where’s the MOTUC Club Eternia® subscription figure for August? Fear not, all 2012 product will ship but Frosta™ will now show up in October (it’s a woman’s prerogative, right?) along with Rattlor™."

          I was refering to "a woman's perogative" as glib

        • Ah, I get it. And you didn't misread it, what happened is I went to MOTUClassics to see when Frosta was due and they had her in October. What I didn't realize was they had already updated it based on the Mattycollector note. I had forgotten she was due this month.

  • If Ram Man doesn't get made I see a perfect opportunity for a 3rd party to start work on a line other than Transformers. They can call him Cram Man and distribute him out of China.

  • I vowed to let this go, as I was at peace with possibly not getting Ram Man, but they keep making boneheaded moves.

    They just announced on Facebook that the post-SDCC sales will be early access and credited (blamed?) A fan for the idea.

    Along with the other announcement about ram man not getting made, I only get more certain of my decision not to sub every day.

  • I also just read the fb comments. This is a real insult to ghostbusters fans who subbed.

    Since there is no sub, the Ecto goggles will be available to scalp for anyone with any sub.

    GB fans have no sub to give them access to the things they want.

    Now its being used to force people to buy a sub to have a chance at getting another property’s item.

    • Yeah, I didn't even think of this. I was in the GB sub before it got canned. I'd glady still be in it. Ecto Goggles should be removed from early access.

  • Man that sucks for everyone wanting Ram-Man….Mattel seem intent on making it difficult for fans to collect MOTU. I gave up MOTUC long ago and I've given up Bandai's Thundercats. Just Playmates TMNT for me to collect now. :D

      • Yep, I think Bandai should have just stuck to making 6" figures, I would have loved Grune and the Mutants to be made 6" aswell.
        But the new show was not as great a the original. :)

  • Yeah…they better make Ram Man.

    The issues with the line, and falsely perceived lack of success, are all Mattel's own doing. They have an almost sadistic penchant for murdering the various incarnations of MOTU (with horrible decisions, poor planning and a generally apathetic attitude) despite their popularity. Toylines have a natural life cycle, but Mattel seems to enjoy expediting the process.

    • I've always felt like this line would be more successful if Mattel took a risk and made more stock available for longer periods of time on their website. But I guess they're not willing to take that risk. (Granted, they thankfully gave in somewhat and have made some of the staple characters regularly available.) Yes, the subs aren't getting the numbers that are needed, but that's a lot of money up front. I can understand while people hesitate. Being able to buy individual figures when you want them would be more palatable for most customers, I'd think.

      • I also think it's possible that it's just the line's time, as much as we want to see it continue. There is no new media to grab new fans aside from the recent comic book, so Mattel is dealing with a limited fanbase. Maybe the numbers just aren't there.

  • About the Scarabus figures… I bought one last year and I was so happy with it I was going to buy more, but when I was ready they were sold out of most of them, and I wasn’t really interested in the ones that were left. So after reading they were still in stock, I was like, huh? It looks to me like the figure did so well they were able to make another run. I could be wrong though. It happens sometimes.

  • Matty tried their very very best to bully DC collectors last year. And what did they get? No pick-up. Hells, they extended the deadline three times because their bullying backfired and offered more information on who was coming, and STILL went ahead even though by their own admission they were still shy of their target.

    So I'm sure there are MOTUC fans out there who are letting this affect their decision. Even if Matty is doubling down this year with more threats about not producing many extra figures and allowing those with a sub to buy first. But they haven't done the carrot yet – letting people know what they can expect.

    What it comes down to is this – are there sufficient figures coming out that warrant a $500 + shipping price tag. And I gotta say no, at least not on the information available. Ram Man and Jitsu really seem to be the only highlights. And King He-Man is a terrible figure as an enticement. What Mattel could have said is we plan do the following figures and had quick art pics done for the show to sell the line. Then people could say yes or no based on reasonable expectations.

    But asking people to pony up for the unknown based on bullying tactics is not the way to run a business.

    • I initially interpreted Matty's position as bullying, but I'm now pretty certain that's not the case and Scott is just being honest about what's needed to save the line. We're not obligated to buy a sub if can't or don't want to, but the fact is a lack of sub will kill the line.

    • To the four horsemen's comment that people seem to think it's a ruse…
      I don't think it's a ruse, I think it's a high pressure sales pitch on an awful business model. Subscription services like this are lame when they cost $500, you aren't certain of all the figures, and no one is really happy with the reveals as a whole.
      And speaking of rising costs, and boo hoo expenses, Mattel, it's a bad economy, consumers are suffering big time. Is it a wonder even dedicated fans aren't plunking down big bucks?

  • It's really unfortunate that the subscription model, which reportedly started as a fan-requested option, ended up becoming the crucial barometer that Mattel uses to judge the sustainability of the line.

    I wish they could institute a pre-order system for each figure, even if all they could show that far in advance was a concept drawing.

    • And you, sir, have hit the nail on the head, in my opinion.

      That subscription went from "there's no way we can do it" to "there's no way we can do without it" is the true cosmic irony of this whole kerfluffle

  • I may not be able to speak for anyone else, but I can certain say why I’m not subscribing again. I’m not spending hundreds of dollars on figures I don’t want. I have like a dozen She-Ra figures sitting in my shed right now, plus all the c-list stinkers from 200X. One month I’m paying $28, next month $95, $48 after that. That’s a lot of money for only liking maybe half of what I got.

    The honeymoon was over for me when the Star-Sisters showed up at my door. I still don’t know who or what they are, I just know that I can’t afford to throw money away on stuff I don’t want. Your reasons may differ, but those are mine.

      • Starla is actually the only one that I don't like a lot. She's ok, but these aren't figures I would have purchased given the option.

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